Interview b y Kathleen S. Carr ’96
The Art of Listening
Chris Matthews ’67, the host of MSNBC’s Hardball and NBC’s The Chris Matthews Show, has been working in journalism for 30 years. He was a longtime Washington bureau chief for The San Francisco Examiner and a national columnist for The San Francisco Chronicle; Matthews also spent six years working as a top aide for Speaker of the House, Thomas P. “Tip” O’Neill. The author of four best-selling books—Kennedy & Nixon, Hardball, Now, Let Me Tell What I Really Think, and American: Beyond Our Grandest Notions—he has received the David Brinkley Award for Excellence in Communications.
Matthews’ latest book, Life’s a Campaign, What Politics Has Taught Me About Friendship, Rivalry, Reputation, and Success, details those qualities that lead to success, both in politics and life. The most important of these, Matthews notes, is the ability to listen.
Carr: What was your motivation in writing this book?
Matthews: I’ve spent 36 years in the company of politicians at the national level, and I’ve learned a lot from them. I spend every night on TV with them, grilling them for facts. But I’ve also watched what they do, how they’ve gotten where they are. I’ve read a lot of memoirs, but this book is the portion of their story that they hate to talk about—how they get where they get and how they deal with rivals. Politicians like people to think God put them where they are, and not that there’s an actual technique that put them there. I wanted to write about the means of their ascent into power. I looked at their alliances, how they get people to vote for them and to contribute to their campaigns.
Carr: What are some of the characteristics you have observed in successful politicians?
Matthews: There are a number of traits that are common to all political leaders: a readiness to listen and a curiosity—they find other people genuinely interesting and that’s a very seductive trait. People love to be listened to. And successful politicians are upbeat; they know optimism is seductive. They’re good at dealing with criticism; they know their rival is out for the same prize they are seeking.
Carr: The Random House write up of your book mentions that Bill Clinton is teaching his wife how to seduce. Is Hillary Clinton amenable to his teaching?
Matthews: She better be, because he’s a pro. His ability to seduce is in his ability to focus laser-like on the people he’s with. He does it by listening. At Oxford, he told his friends that this is the way to get the girl of your dreams, to listen to them. He was always good in school at predicting the questions in blue books because he listened to professors and could predict what they would ask on an exam.
Carr: What’s your take on Nancy Pelosi?
Matthews: She’s the kind of politician who keeps her deals. She paid her dues, and this was very powerful for her. Her father used to keep a favors list of people who had done favors for him and people he owed. You return favors in politics, or you don’t get ahead. Loyalty is a very powerful tool, and it’s important to have it known that you repay your debts. Ask for help, and be willing to listen. These are basic positive human traits that work for politicians and all who lead.
Carr: Is it permissible to ask for favors?
Matthews: Before you ask a person for a favor, make sure you’ve spent some time with them—don’t ask for a favor the first time you meet. George Bush senior was excellent at this. He had great success with the Persian Gulf coalition because he had been cultivating relationships for years with these leaders. He was friends with Mubarak, the president of Egypt; he took him to baseball games. He nurtured his relationships, and when the time came to go to war, he was able to call in help. He was on top of everything. Begin to build relationships before you need them. Letter writing, and keeping up with people—these are powerful tools in life. I wanted to show that these softer traits of human nature are the essence of power—in the end, they are what separates the leaders from the followers. For years, I spent every morning with Tip O’Neill, and I learned that he was all about personal relationships.
Carr: And Bill Clinton, why does he stand out?
Matthews: Bill Clinton kept in contact with every person he met. But, he also puts up with rivalry and criticism. You have to be able to get on an airplane and know that half the people on the plane won’t like you. You have to have the guts to be who you are and live with the fact that some people will not like you. And, in the face of rivalry, you do your best work. Athletes live this every day.
Carr: Do politicians get points for good behavior?
Matthews: You have to bring together good behavior with success—they aren’t trade-offs. If you do the right good things you’ll be successful as well. I want to teach people how to select the traits that bring them leadership.
Carr: Did Holy Cross influence your opinions on what it means to live well and be successful?
Matthews: I took a lot of things from Holy Cross. The great thing about going to Holy Cross in the 1960s was that we really did have philosophical discussions. Every semester. You didn’t realize until you graduated that you were a philosophy major. And it’s not that Holy Cross people are better than other people on the planet, but there was a recognition about being right or wrong about things. I think people who are at Holy Cross now are even more in tune with community service. I chose the Peace Corps as a means of alternative service. Today people are doing that without war as an option. It was a tough time during the draft. Every day of your life was accounted for.
Watch for Chris Matthews on upcoming broadcasts of The Today Show, The Tonight Show, The Daily Show, Charlie Rose and The View.
Kathleen S. Carr is a freelance writer based in Melrose, Mass. She can be reached via email at kath.carr@gmail.com
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